Real Estate Show Milan Hanson Estate Attorney

Real Estate Show Milan Hanson Estate Attorney

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Real Estate Show - Milan Hanson

Alice Lema: [00:00:00] Well, hello, Southern Oregon. And welcome back to the real estate show. I'm Alice Lema. I'm your host of the real estate show. So happy you could join us again. I'm a broker here with John L. Scott real estate in Southern Oregon. And today we are gonna be talking to Mr. Milan Hanson of Hanson legal. He is an estate attorney.

He does real estate. He also does wills, probate, and corporate. The reason we like having Mr. Milan on the show is to remind everybody what happens if you don't have your ducks in a row and then there's an emergency. So he's gonna remind us about wills, about trust. Also since Oregon is not a community property state single folks that may not have everything written down or you're in some kind of a partnership with somebody and don't have things written down that is handled differently in Oregon than a lot of other states in the union. So he's gonna remind us of how to take care of all that, and also talk about some real [00:01:00] estate legal issues.

So it's a great show. It's always wonderful to have Milan on the show and remind us of what we need to do legally so that if there is an emergency things go a little bit more smoothly, cuz emergencies are never fun. And then you have legal problems on top of it and then it's worse. So. Milan Hanson joining us today.

Before we get to that interview wanna speak briefly about what happened in our local market this week. It was another topsy turvy week in the world, but I do wanna say that it looks like some of the interest rate increases are slowly being absorbed into our market.

And what that means is we have a surprising high number of price reductions this week. And we also have a pretty healthy amount of back on market. That means people lost their escrow and they had to put their listing up for sale again. So just to give you an idea of what happened this week in Southern Oregon and that's Jackson county and Josephine county combined is how I'm running these numbers [00:02:00] today. We had 130 new listings. So in Jackson and Josephine county, this week, we had 130 new listings, but we had 33 back on market. Those are folks that lost their escrow and put it up for sale again. And then we had 158 price changes. So 158 people changed their prices to kind of accommodate for the changing market. So stay tuned for what happens next week. We'll have another report.

In the meantime, before we get to our interview with Milan Hanson of Hanson, legal, wanna say thank you to our sponsors, John L. Scott Ashland in Medford, our local Rogue Valley Association of Realtors and Guy Giels of Churchill Mortgage.

We appreciate you so much helping us bring this show to the folks here in Southern Oregon every week. So we'll be right back with Milan Hanson. Don't touch that dial.

Well, welcome back Southern Oregon to the real estate show. I'm Alice Lema. I'm a broker here in beautiful Southern Oregon with John L. Scott real estate. And today [00:03:00] I'm so excited to talk to one of my favorite people in the whole world. Attorney Milan Hansen from Hansen legal. Welcome back Milan.

Milan Hanson: Hello, it's great to be back.

Alice Lema: So you do a lot of estate attorney estate law, and also real estate law. And we had you on the show before and it was really, really helpful. So we wanted to have you back and kind of bring people up to speed. Not only about any changes that have happened in the last couple of years, but also just a good reminder about basic good estate practice and also good real estate practice.

Milan Hanson: Absolutely. And, and I could probably talk hours on these issues and sometimes we'll, we'll, we'll, we'll mention a little project or something.

But I'll, I'll sometimes when real estate gets involved in the estate planning it, I mean, you can cut it so many different ways. And, but people [00:04:00] aren't typically, aren't just thinking about it. And if all I could do is just get people to think about it a little different and start asking some questions. I, I feel like I've done my job.

Alice Lema: And that is the most helpful thing because a lot of people own homes and have not made any arrangements. And so before we got started, you were mentioning that you have some clients that are in that situation. They've recently come to talk to you about that.

And it just sounds so typical of people not being ready. I wondered if you wanted to share some advice about how people, you know, help them not wait till the last minute.

Milan Hanson: Yeah. I, I mean, just, everyone's so busy. We're so busy. I mean, we, we feel like we live in this time when we have time savers everything's convenient, but for some reason we just don't feel like we ever have time there's oh, I'm gonna get to it.

When you know, I, everything kind of comes together and I feel like I have a minute to breathe. And as my dad said, And he's been in this a real estate attorney here in Southern [00:05:00] Oregon for over 40 years. And he said, you know, it's okay to have problems because the only day you're not gonna have problems is the day that you you're dead.

Oh. But we keep thinking that there is all this time and sometime it it's, it is for my business clients, for my real estate investor clients, some of that planning comes now. If I can, if I can ever get people to do it, do it, do it early, keep it up to date. And I have a crystal ball on my desk. It's almost like a, a, just a joke piece because everybody wants to know what the future is.

They said we don't know. But the one thing I often see is that people keep thinking, I will have this one day where I'll be able to sit down and think about it. But life happens. And you know, as soon as you get a little extra money, then maybe you're thinking about your vacation. Maybe you're thinking about something else, but you're sitting down taking a look at what you have and like what what's gonna go where, and people are constantly negotiating themselves.

I'm seeing real [00:06:00] estate investors that say, well, I wanna buy a house for my kid or you know, but they keep the title in their own name. And then I'd say, wait a second. Okay. You know, maybe your kid's paying you rent or something on that. And you have this, this family deal. Maybe you wanna loan money to your kid to buy their own home, or you put them in one of your units.

And then the question is, Hey, is this family deal? You got a bunch more kids. If something happens, there's nothing in writing that says that, that one house that maybe your kid's investing in. Or maybe that they're like, Hey, they're gonna have this one unit, this one house, but then they build an ADU.

They've invested one, another, a hundred thousand dollars of their own money in the unit. And there's nothing that says that that house is definitively theirs. And if something were to go wrong, if they were to pass away, I sometimes have to tell the family, oh, wait, you have to move off this house. But wait, it was my house.

And I said, well, I'm sorry. Your name wasn't on title [00:07:00] and the estate plan says we're gonna, or here, if you don't have a plan, the state of Oregon has one for you. And that is we have to sell that home and then split that money up against all with all your brothers and sisters. Oh my gosh. And so that is probably way more common than we realize, and it's not just adult children paying to be on the property.

We have elders that are doing that on the adult children's property and not writing it down a lot. A lot of times the family deal, I mean, I've had big development, big, big, real estate developers come in here. And I've taken a look at their plans, but these, these side deals that they do with their family and they it's all done over a handshake.

So it causes me anxiety on the back end. I love being an attorney. I love people telling you, you know, if I can get people to pay, to pay attention, create a plan. But that plan it has to be in writing. [00:08:00] Because the one thing about estate planning is, if there comes a time where you're either in a hospital and we cannot ask you that question, or if you've passed away or if maybe you're here and sometime, and I just had a client this morning who was a real estate investor and she had maybe four to five properties.

Maybe there was another six that was kind of, she'd kind of lost track of, and you think it's kind of crazy that people can lose track of their properties and I, I see it happen. But so many of these, most of these estate planning issues, none of them are ever intentional. They just come from, they come with the best of intentions, but really not, not writing down what the plan is, not formalizing it because if, if, and when something happens, that is when it's too late to do an emergency plan.

Right. And sometimes people have a lot of ideas about how they want their, their investments to be used [00:09:00] or here we're passing it down to another generation. Are they gonna be able to manage those properties. Sometimes the kids will just say, Nope, sorry. I wanna live I'm in another state. I have my own job. I don't wanna be a landlord.

And they just wanna sell all those properties as soon as the earliest opportunity they get, they, they probably will. But nobody ever talks like, really comes as a meeting, like as a family. And has that meeting what's gonna happen with the family's property. Whereas, especially as we get older and we start to slow down, we have less energy.

We have these properties, what are we gonna do? Well, you know, you could go to a financial investor and they know how to manage money, but so often if you have properties and you're like, wait, I've been managing, I've been a landlord for 20 years. And I don't need anybody. I don't need an, a, a property management company.

I need somebody to go collect the rents and do the repairs, but starting to think about, [00:10:00] hey, wait a second. If there's a change in your life, if you start to run outta energy, or sometimes we, we slip a little. And I've had a lot of people get to an age where they just say, Hey, I love being a, a property investor, it's just a little much for me right now. How do we start to transition and shift?

Alice Lema: Mm-hmm mm-hmm. So when you're dealing with people, how, how do you talk to them about making these plans? When I'm out, helping people buy and sell houses, I always bring it up, but it's very hard to get them to actually make the phone call in there.

Milan Hanson: I try to get as much education, get as much education out for free. And I have another two hour session called a family work planning session that people do with me. I, I have you fill out some homework and that homework tells me about [00:11:00] your family dynamics and about your assets. Oh, and how they're titled.

Eh, and sometimes people, they, they, they drag their feet. They think that, hey, that's, it's really tough, but wait a second. By the time you come into me and I do this family work planning session, I say it's $750, I will wave that fee if you do the work and you show up on time.

Alice Lema: Wow. That is amazing.

Milan Hanson: So once we, the first thing that'll happen and it's so hard, everybody knows exactly what they have in their own minds. Oh, I know these five properties or I know I have a bank account here, here and here, but we're just trying to get it outta your head and onto paper so then you can really like interact with it. And sometimes people say, oh, hey, I have a tax preparer. Well, a lot of times the tax preparer, or they think that they have a bookkeeper or some CPA, it's really just doing the taxes.

They're looking at the income that's coming in, but they sometimes aren't really seeing all the properties that you already have and how big your portfolio is of the [00:12:00] stuff that you've already bought. So in that session, say, hey, let's, let's take a look at it. And one of the big thing, first of all, I'm doing that homework and just getting it outlined what you have.

I can see title issues. Sometimes I'll say, wait a second. You know, hey, we have a property, you know, spouse, you know, the wife owns one property here. The husband owns another property over there. They don't own it jointly. They don't own it. Or they own a property with, with one of their kids.

Wait a second. Do we own that? Or do we have as much control over that piece of real estate, as much as what we, oh, no, really? That's mine. I'm the one that pays the mortgage. And I say, wait a second. yeah, that's mine. But those words in the legal world. I'm like, wait a second. No, these are other people on title. They technically are our owners.

Yeah. How is that gonna affect you? So getting back down to these, these handshake agreements, or one thing that you [00:13:00] talked about, I think before we started recording was having a partner, a lifelong partner. And somebody that you're unmarried to, maybe they're, you're living with them. You're acting kind of like spouses.

If something was to happen to you, I would tell you that that person is a legal stranger. They're not entitled to anything. And if this goes through, if you don't do a plan, the state of Oregon's got a plan, your kids, maybe from another relationship, they they're gonna inherit. If something happens to you that makes your partners living in your house a little, a little less stable, because maybe they just assumed that they were gonna be there for, until they, they, they were gonna be in that house until they died as well.

But taking a look at those title issues, their name is not on it. There's no estate plan in place that gives them any right to the place. And so many, I, I don't like cleaning up those [00:14:00] issues after the fact, because by the time something's happened, I have to say, wait a second. Now we gotta, I'm sorry, we gotta get, we gotta get the other person off the property and I have to get it sold so the kids can get their inheritance.

Alice Lema: And that is so heartbreaking. We have that happen so often. And the other person frequently was surprised. Like you just said Milan they thought they were gonna get to have their end days there too. And it's hard. It's hard on older people to suddenly be homeless.

Milan Hanson: It happens more often than you would think. Or I have people that come in, they wanna leave something for their partner. But they say, wait, I just want my partner to live in the house, but I wanna keep the money, the value in the house. I wanna keep that for my kids. And they're coming up with a plan that'll actually accomplish that.

It has to be written down because when you are not around to ask we do not let any of the family members or your [00:15:00] partner or anyone else to say, oh, they would've wanted this. Or, Hey, they promised me to that I could live in the house because usually those statements are so kind of self-serving. It's always, hey, the benefit was to me, this is what I was promised, or I was told this is what I would expect.

But expectations could be the enemy of happiness in that if those promises or those family agreements are handshake deals, even with someone that we love and trust very closely. And I have to tell people legally, they are a stranger. They have no no right to any of your property.

Alice Lema: Man that is just such a heartbreaking moment. Yeah. So we're gonna have to take a quick break. We're talking to Milan Hanson of Hanson legal, discussing estate issues, real estate in general investing. One of our favorite' favorite guests on the real estate show will be back after quick word from our sponsors. We are brought to you by John L. Scott Ashland, and Medford, the Rogue Valley Association of Realtors and [00:16:00] Guy Giles, Churchill Mortgage. Will be right.

Well, hi again, folks. Alice Lema here, broker John L. Scott. Welcome back to the real estate show. Milan Hanson is our guest today from Hanson legal. And we're just getting an earful about what happens when you're not prepared for your estate and your real estate issues.

Gosh, right before the break Milan, you were talking a little bit about sometimes what happens to life partners when they don't write things down and there's real estate.

Milan Hanson: Yeah, just with, I think so many people and I'll, I'll always say this, problems happen even with good intentions. That people expect something to happen and they assume that it's gonna turn out okay. But they haven't even probed the question of what could happen. And every time I have someone come in, I say, hey, you're my client, not your partner, not your spouse, not your kids. And this would be nice to leave them [00:17:00] something, but in, in, and this is another aspect about it's so many real estate investors that I see that have two six, sometimes 10 properties.

Sometimes they're very, very like land rich, sometimes cash, or I'm taking a look on the back end. Like what have you been, how have you been feeding your retirement accounts? How have you been feeding your actual finances? Do you have other more liquid investments that we can draw on?

And many of the times when I'm taking a look and you don't have cash, and sometimes if I do this asset inventory with people and I say, wait a second, Hey, look at all, all that you, hey, you got. I've told people, Hey, congratulations. Did you know that you're a millionaire? They're like, what I really, I am.

And I say, yeah, I mean, very easily with one or two houses, you can get up. I mean, if the average median house, I mean to 300, most likely $400,000 for a home. If you have two homes, you're very, you're, [00:18:00] you're creeping up to this million mark. And this million mark, it's kind of interesting, cuz I mean, first of all, we always talk about like the idea, the dream of becoming a millionaire.

But now here in the year, 2022, a millionaire is not quite what it meant 10, 10, 20 years ago here. I mean, you have to be almost like to what we think of like as a millionaire would be like somewhere in between five, 5 million more. Gotcha. That's when you start to have like this, this amount of wealth that you're like, oh, well, hey, I'm well beyond this boundary. I'm well, I'm well taken care of I'm I maybe have more than enough for myself in my own retirement, but even then taking a look at those assets, are they in cash?

Can we convert them to cash? Because another, sometimes people in estate planning were so focused on death. And, but death, hey, that's, it's gonna go to the next generation. Have we groomed that generation? Can they take over, can they manage those properties? Are they gonna have to sell it? What's gonna happen to the [00:19:00] family ranch? Is one kid gonna get, oh, well, you know, hey, my kids will, they'll take it. And I said, wait a second. That's one piece of property. And you're assuming, three kid, three, four kids or something can, can manage that together. And it's like, no, that most likely they're not, they're gonna have to sell it off because they'll all have different competing ideas about what to do with that property, even though you wanted to keep it in the family.

But so often I'm like, wait a second. Even if we have a couple properties, I'm not thinking about what the kids are gonna get. I mean, they're gonna get taken care of. They can liquidate the properties and they can get their inheritance.

Another bigger aspect is thinking about what's gonna happen to you. Sometimes you're my client. And if you're entering a new stage of your life, maybe a lot of people, they don't want to consider it. They don't wanna look at their retirement. Maybe these properties were their retirement. But now that they're there, they're not thinking about how to turn it, that this, this [00:20:00] asset that maybe they've been having renters they've had tenants pay their mortgage.

Maybe their mortgages are paid off by now. Now this is just income to them, but. Maybe they've been managing the, the property, but may I think get a few thousand. And hey, they've lived a comfortable life, but I'm like, wait a second. In this next stage of your life, are you really considering what you're gonna need to live on so that you can remain in your own house?

Having a I have a discussion with people where we try to consider that maybe that uncomfortable part about getting older. And that is the part about it is that loss of control, that loss of independence, that loss is sometimes of mobility and, and being able to make your own decisions and just waiting too long.

You, if you, if you wait too long, then, I mean it so many realtors so many other real estate investors say, ah, I don't need an attorney until I need one. But too [00:21:00] often it becomes like, hey, when you could you call? Cause there's already a problem. I, I have to deal with how the, the table has been set with the cards as they are given to me. There is almost little to no time to change or if we do have to do something and this is sometimes thinking about what it will cost in your retirement, what will your healthcare cost be? They can be going up. To even remain in your home to have in care, home service that can start to cost several thousands of dollars on top of what you were already using just for your own support and benefit. I mean, just for your income.

Alice Lema: So in that, in that scenario I would think that you'd have to talk to people more often then, because as their condition deteriorates and healthcare costs go up, is it possible they just wouldn't have enough money?

Milan Hanson: Well, I, I, I, I have to tell, and it's so [00:22:00] hard at this point. It's like sometimes like looking at a kid and they have all their toys. And they don't wanna like they're, they have 'em all. And they're hardly being able to like, hold onto anything or grab something new. They got all their toys and they don't wanna let one go. But I was like, wait, it would be a little easier if you let something go.

Maybe you sold that because then you'd have some money to start to fund your lifestyle or even then to pay for some of your medical bills. And a hard part of it is I say, yes, you've spent this time building up this real estate portfolio. You've spent years, your blood, sweat, your tear.

Sometimes, maybe you weren't out there going out to bars, buying fancy cocktails. A lot of my clients have been skimping and saving. And that's life, their whole life. And then they finally, they arrive they're at retirement age and they're still maintaining that, that very, that scarcity mindset.

And I say, wait a second, hey, look, you have about 2 million. You have about, you know, in assets, this isn't [00:23:00] the end of the world. You've done a good job, but how are we gonna turn those assets into something that you can use, so that you can start to wind down? You can start to slow down and, and approach that next phase of life with grace and without fear. Hey, you saved, you did it, but now we have to let something go because maybe during the, this time of skrimping and saving, paying these mortgages down, you haven't been taking this money.

A lot of times when I'm talking to financial, like the financial advisors stocks can be cleared out really quickly for money if it's needed. If there's a significant cost, you get a cancer diagnosis. Oh, wait, what's this gonna cost? Sometimes if people don't have health insurance, sometimes they, they sacrifice health insurance, so they can wait, wait a second but I bought more houses.

If you don't have that, thinking about how we can start to fund your retirement. And I have so many people, they maybe they're at this [00:24:00] point and they haven't spent any money on themselves. And I say, wait, you know, it's great. We'd like it to go to your kids, but you've spent you, you have your blood, sweat, and tears have gone into building this portfolio your whole life. You can go have fun.

I mean, it'd be nice to give it to your kids, but it's your money spend it. And I, whatever it is to you for your quality, for the quality of your life is the most important thing. And as that's changing. Some people absolutely, some people don't want to admit that we're getting older.

And I'll say, Hey, maybe you think I'm a young guy. I am right there behind everybody else. And I'm like, nope, nope. I'm gonna blink and be, I'm gonna blink be in my fifties, blink. I'm gonna be in my sixties blink. Oh, how I'm 70? How did this, where am I? What are, and we're sometimes going through responding to everything that's coming up and we're doing it to the best of our abilities.

But sometimes we aren't thinking we have a long range plan, but we, we haven't quite finalized it. What [00:25:00] property we want to go to which kid. Who's, if somebody's living in our house, a partner, maybe a kid, how's that gonna affect them. And have we like, even by letting somebody live with us, have we created this expectation that they're gonna be having a comfortable place to live for the rest of their life.

Alice Lema: Not everybody is, is set up to manage real estate. A lot of real estate investors think, oh, well, this kid will take care of it, or that person will take care of it. They don't really have the skill. They don't, they didn't spend the lifetime growing that part of themselves.

Milan Hanson: So absolutely. It that is another, I mean, I just had a client this morning had two daughters. And it was a very, very hard conversation. Is that wait her, she didn't think that her daughters would be good at stepping up. And I say, hey, you know, they're gonna get taken care of, but I'm really worried about my client. What's [00:26:00] gonna happen to you. I want you to be taken care of. And if you slow down, that somebody's gonna be there writing the checks to make sure that your bills are paid even. You might not be able to do that.

Alice Lema: Yeah. Yeah. That's really, really good advice. So let me ask you in the few minutes that I've left in this segment People that are younger, that are just starting. Maybe they just bought their first house. But they're not married and I'm not being political or anything here, folks. It's just that Oregon like you like to say, Milan Oregon has a plan if you don't. And sometimes unmarried people don't realize that. Can we speak briefly to that scenario.

Milan Hanson: We do not have what's called common law marriage. So, no matter if you are living with someone, they're your partner in your mind, you kind of are married. We're not gonna assume that you are because you have to go through that. You have to make that promise. And I just got married last, last weekend. So I'm, I'm one into it and I've already updated [00:27:00] my estate plan to make sure that but, and it's becoming more and more popular. For different reasons it, it doesn't, sometimes people have already been married before they just say, hey, you know, I can love you, but I don't wanna, you know, I don't need to do that.

I don't wanna fully fully make that legal commitment. And maybe they think that that doesn't mean anything. Hey, as long as I'm living with you, we're, we're in love. We're fine and that's good. The problem is, is that person is still considered to be a legal stranger. They have no right to inherit from you.

They have no right to make decisions for you. If you go into a hospital, the doctor will say, Hey, what, what's your spouse. And you could maybe say this person, but they're like, wait a second. I'm not, you're not married to them. The doctor will be like, well, I'm sorry. You're not a family member. You, you're not, we're not gonna talk to you.

Alice Lema: Yeah, that's heartbreaking too.

Milan Hanson: So getting those, you can absolutely get your wishes, put them onto paper. And now all of a sudden, now you have a piece of paper that says, oh, this person is in charge or [00:28:00] they get this. They, they, if you don't have a plan, these default rules in Oregon, Or that it goes, your, your stuff could pass to a family member. Bloodline usually by your bloodlines.

And I often see problems with .Stepkids step kids can get disinherited very, very quickly and sometimes unintentionally, oh wow. I had some, some kids come in. I say kids. I mean, they're in their forties and fifties. Their parents passed, their dad had passed away six years ago and he had about 3 million of properties and they had a stepmother. And their stepmother inherited everything by rights and survivorship on the deads.

And they didn't realize it that when their finally their stepmother passed away. They weren't gonna get, they like, wait, our stepmom passed. Both our parents have passed. Our stepmom, never had kids of our own.

We're the only kids that she's ever had. And I had to explain to them that they weren't [00:29:00] gonna inherit as step kids. They weren't in the bloodline.

Alice Lema: Well, was that another quick break? I'm so sorry. Is this so interesting? Milan Hanson will be back in just a quick second. Hold that thought. Don't touch that channel.

Well, hello again, everybody. Welcome back to the real estate show. Alice Lema here, broker John Scott, talking to Milan Hanson of Milan of Hanson legal, not Milan legal Hansen legal. And we were just having a really interesting conversation about what happens to stepchildren, step parents. When somebody dies real estate estate scenarios finish your thought on that one story you were telling us, cuz it sounded heartbreaking.

Milan Hanson: I, love being a lawyer. I love giving people advice, especially if there's something we can prevent, but when something happens, if nobody came forward, I sometimes I hate being the bearer of bad news. That this is the law, or this is what we are. This is the state and we can't get out of it. Well, what if we [00:30:00] just changed?

Sorry. The opportunity for planning has gone out the window. And in this, this particularly sad case, I mean, there's a bunch of variations I see of it. These kids had $3 million of property that their dad had built up the real estate portfolio over his lifetime. And they, they, they got disinherited, maybe even by accident, nobody had talked about it.

Nobody had done anything. And very, and it's been scrambling to try to figure out what to do. But sometimes it's the first person that brings, brings the person, whether you are the partner or whether you are the kid bringing, bringing your parent in, or your partner into the attorney to come up with a plan because sometime you're taking something at face value. Hey, Hey, you've said that you got something, it won't matter. It, what you think you have will not exist by the time the law kicks in and we're like, wait a [00:31:00] second. Are you getting here? ,So just taking a look at that, taking a look at the title issues, how you own your property.

If you have property in a bunch of states, I'll always tell people, Hey, you know, trust is gonna be more important for multi-state issues. Oh, Just because we would have to go through probate in every single state where there is property.

Alice Lema: Oh, wow. Wow. That sounds burdensome. Oh my gosh.

Milan Hanson: How many of these things, just so many real estate investors aren't there aren't consider. I mean, they're, they're trying to look for the next deal, the next property to buy. How are they gonna buy it? But wait a second. What are you building all this. What are you building? I mean, are you, if you haven't contemplated how you're gonna spend that money for yourself and fund your own retirement, or, and I want to know how are you gonna be taken care of through health whether it waxes and wains. And there's gonna be a point where [00:32:00] it may be at a low point and you might not be able to manage those problems, how who's gonna keep paying your bills.

Alice Lema: That's what I was wondering. Cuz a lot of older, real estate investors, surprisingly don't have a plan. I'm always shocked. They were so good at acquiring all these properties and keep 'em going. So what happens if you have a real estate investor and they're not married and they get dementia? And they don't have money for their care. If they haven't written anything down, how does the family sell anything off to take care of them? How does that work?

Milan Hanson: Well at that point and I, and I have a lot of clients that are probably they're somewhere at the early stages of dementia. So the legal determination for, we call it capacity. And say, hey, can this person, do they have enough brain cells? Do they ask to actually make an estate plan and the legal standards very low. If you have a moment, a lucid moment, you're in it. And I have to ask one, these two questions. Do you know what you own? And do you [00:33:00] know where you want it to go?

And if they say, oh, I have this property, this property, this property, this property, I say, Hey great. Because sometimes even if you have dementia you could be forgetting who the names of your kids. But you, you know, your properties. like, cause me a lot grief, you know, I had a tenant there and I had this problem. Sometimes that is it. It's, it's funny. Even with dementia, the way it affects us and you can know what you have. And I have had people absolutely forget what property they own.

And, and I'm like, wait a second. We're coming in a little late. We've identified the property. And I say, okay, this is good. Are you having a moment now? Hey, yeah. Hey, I'm good. I catch 'em for, while they're in this office, they know what they have and where they want it to go. We can do an estate plan. But what if they can't then, then what happens if they can't?

Yeah, we are absolutely in a whole other world. There's something called guardianship and conservatorship. And if you're at a point where you cannot, you don't have a plan. And there's nobody [00:34:00] as a backup and designated because we live in the United States of America. We very much care about our individual rights, our ownership rights, our property rights.

We do not take that lightly. You could be crazy. That's fine that, hey, craziness is just a part of the human condition you know, it's, it's almost by what, what flavor you are. But how you, if you want your wishes to be respected. You have to write them down in the proper way that that's estate planning.

If you don't now we have this process, guardianship and conservatorship where someone, and typically it'll be the hospital. The hospital will say, hey, we can't release this person. Oh, they can't make decisions on their own anymore. And we had another attorney in our office that he would be getting calls from the hospital for emergency guardianship conservatorships.

The person would be, they'd have to release them, say, hey, we wanna get you outta the hospital. You're stabilized. But we don't think you're able to make your own decisions. This is a court process, and [00:35:00] sometimes the court will initiate it. They'll have a person come forward and say, Hey, we need to, they'll send out a court visitor.

And this is a psychologist that'll interview the person that is going through this and to see, hey, are you able to manage? And they're a psychologist, even if you're, they have a lucid moment and they speak really well, they can kind of pry into that and say, well, yeah, but they, they, they kind of missed a few things. Or yeah, after an hour, they ended up repeating themselves and they almost forgot who I was.

Oh, there is this process. We are gonna try to find somebody to, we strip your rights away to make decisions for yourself and we grant it to another person. A guardian or, and conservator conservator is typically dealing with the money and a guardian is gonna be there to make the decisions your day to day decisions of where you're gonna live.

And as so many people are aging alone. And even if you have a partner you're technically still aging alone. This legal partner, I mean, it's not a legal partner [00:36:00] because your partner regardless, how close that relationship is, and they may be cooking and cleaning for you. They have no access to your bank accounts.

And we don't know if they're actually gonna be managing that money to your benefit versus are they gonna take that money and be so scared and wanna remain in the home that they don't make any decisions. Cause like, wait, you're gonna stay here with me because I don't wanna spend that money down or have to sell this house to fund your fund your, fund your medical.

Alice Lema: Wow those are hard, hard life decisions at a time when it's not, there's no good, good solution.

Milan Hanson: That that is maybe some of the worst case scenario. Maybe some of the kids come forward and say they wanna be a guardian or conservator . But if, hey, they didn't want, weren't interested in managing your properties before, or they live in another state, they have their own life. They have their own family to take care of. They might not be interested in coming back and helping you. And then this is where [00:37:00] there are professional guardianships and conservators.

Alice Lema: Yeah. See, I didn't know that that can actually be really helpful to a family. In the couple minutes we have left and we're definitely gonna have to have you on with so much more to talk about. Let's go back to that two hour planning block you were talking about. What kind of questions get asked how people can get ahold of you and, and start getting this process going.

Milan Hanson: Yeah, I, it it's called the family world planning session. I've really, really asked people to tell me about their family dynamic. Tell me about the, the assets they own. And sometimes people wanna keep it close to the chest. And some people are very, very private, even with me as an attorney. And I say, wait a second.

You know, I got confidentiality. I'm not, I'm not just Joe Schmo here. I can't go shout to the world what you have. But sometimes by keeping it close to the chest, it's really a control piece. Because at some point we will have to relinquish control. And if [00:38:00] we do that, this is where we can lose property.

This is where property goes to the state of Oregon as lost and unclaimed. Oh, there just last year, $80 million with the Oregon was lost unclaimed property. They have over 600 million, like over half a billion. And so I know that we're losing some, I know that we're missing pieces, well, If you don't get a person to put it out on paper ahead of time. So the planning is very, very effective in that.

Alice Lema: Milan Hanson from Hanson legal wealth of information. Thank you so much. We'll have you again on soon. See you next week, folks.

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